FISH CATCHING TRAVEL

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I figured the tide post would generate a few comments, and they started right away.  Like I said, my post was an attempt to try to find a simple way to try to get to the right place at the right time.  But there is obviously way more to it than that. In fact, this subject will be discussed for a while and I will combine everything with the first post.  This comment from Colby is from a guy who has obviously done his homework on and off the water and I am happy to share it with you.

Doug,
Without a doubt the best book to learn about tides is Beyond The Moon by James Greig McCully. Chapter 12 – The Tides and Saltwater Fishing is especially helpful for coastal anglers. Texas coastal fishermen need to remember a couple of things. First the tide only changes about one foot along the Texas coast. Other locations around the world have a much greater tidal change than does the Texas coast. Also the wind plays a big roll along the Texas coast. With a wind of 15 mph or more the areas away from the Gulf openings may not feel a tide change at all! Ever notice how Rockport might have 4 tides while POC only has one? How can that be? Tides are a very interesting part of learning how to fish the coast. And now to really make it confusing the velocity of the tides is actually slowing down right now! Let me know how to send you a graph I did showing tides over the last 20 years and how the velocity is actually slowing down. Big subject. Fun stuff.

Colby

It is fun stuff for sure, and your comments are great.  The graph sounds cool and informative so an email is on the way so we can take a look at it.  I will be interested in any comments you may have on the velocity slowing down.  Have to think about that.  In my reading it was real apparent right away that the farther you are from the opening/pass the less you may feel the tide.  And I am with you on the 15mph plus wind, those are the days the wind keeps the water up, or empties the bay.  So in other words, big wind beats a weak tide in water a long way from the openings.  Last, I fished Florida quite a few years before I started fishing here.  At first I asked a couple of people what happened to the tide.  I was out there a few days my first trip before I realized over a foot was it.  I was like that’s the tide?  In Florida it might be a 4′ tide that hauls butt, here there are times a good ripple is the size of it.  Thanks for your informative comments, I am going to add them to the tide post.

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Colby followed up right away with a really interesting and informative chart.  Look at it closely and then read his comments.  It will get you to thinking and also shows how uninformed many of us are.

(Sorry the words are not readable.  I attempted to fix it but for some reason it is not clear on the site.  So for clarification the numbers on the left go from 0 at the bottom to 30 at the top, days of the month of June.  The small words on the right are on the line where the days fishing was  excellent, very good, or good during that month and year in June.  The bottom line is the years.  When the jagged line falls below the small words on the right there were none of those “Good Fishing” days, only fair or poor.  Sorry for the inconvienance.) 

Doug,

Here is the graph.

The information presented is:

The (jagged) line represents the number of “Good Fishing” days for each June for the years 1997 through 2016.  “Good Fishing” days defined as Good, Very Good or Excellent days as shown in the Gulf Coast Fisherman magazine.  The poor or fair days are not included.

Each day of the month is represented as being one of these five categories for potential fishing success.  I’ve used these calendars for over 25 years and always found them to be accurate.  I became concerned when I noticed fewer “Good Fishing” days in the month of June.  As the graph shows in earlier years there were numerous “Good Fishing” days each month.  Now there are some June(s) when there are none!

I contacted Gulf Coast Fisherman Publisher Gary Ralston about this graph and he told me he had been noticing the trend for several years.  He did confirm there is an 18 year cycle that takes place that has some effect on this but he also confirmed that in fact the velocity ( what gives us the good, very good and excellent days) was slowing down.  He also told me that Florida was even worse than Texas.

I use to always plan on trips in June on the triple XXX days because that’s when the tide moved at enough velocity to cause some great feeding activity.  But now with the slower velocity things have changed.

So far I haven’t been able to find out the reason for this change but I haven’t given up either.

I think it is also very important when discussing tides to realize when a tide starts moving that it does not move at a steady rate.   The tide builds and has a greater velocity at certain times during the tide.  The tide chart activity actually looks more like a set of stair steps instead of a smooth bell curve.  This important detail is discussed in the McCully book I mentioned.

NO DOUBT students of tides will catch more fish.  Fish are simply more active when the tide is moving whether it’s an incoming or outgoing tide and less active during slack tide.

The best tide to fish?  Whenever you can.  Tides simply mean during the day you can fish there will be more active times and less active times during that 24 hour period.  Use the tide charts to help you decide where you want to be during those more active times.

Colby

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Considering Colby’s comments before, water velocity is a prime factor.  Here is a really interesting point by Steve along with a great site.

Thanks a bunch Doug! You did a really good job at of explaining a complicated problem. WHEN WILL THE WATER MOVE AGAIN AT MY LOCATION? There is a website that I use that shows tidal coefficient and puts a number value on each tide. In other words how much water will move on that tide compared to other tides? This website graph shows the progression of the tidal coefficient in the month of October 2016 for POC. Large coefficients indicate important high and low tides; major currents and movements usually take place on the sea bed. But bear in mind that this tidal amplitude may be greatly affected by the weather. (WIND) An east wind will over power the low tides around POC and tend to stack water.
http://www.tides4fishing.com/us/texas/port-o-connor
I watched an animated video once that showed the tide as a bubble of water moving across the bay. The most interesting part of the video showed how the fisherman can follow the bubble of water and either fish an ebb tide or a flood depending on what part of the bay he chose to fish. If you were really sharp you could find a falling tide, somewhere on our bay system every day depending on where you chose to fish.
Thanks again, you are always helpful.

This is a much better explanation than mine the other day when I tried to get that concept across.  Thinking of the tide as bubble is the perfect way to look at it.  And when you think about it, if the time difference from the furthest point from the opening remains basically the same, give or take a little, it should be possible to make an educated guess on following that bubble.  For me, if I could fish a falling tide the rest of my life I would be thrilled.  So thanks for the great information, and the site.  And as far as being helpful, I just hope to moderate and encourage the discussion.  Thanks, I appreciate your participation.

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And then after reading my rant on the tides my buddy Todd said it best about the way many of us approach the tide.  There is always someone out there who can interject a voice of reason.

Great read Doug! Someone once told me, go to a local store and pick up a local tide chart. Then when you get to the water, crumple it up and throw it in. Whichever way it floats, that’s the way the tide’s moving

So true. If I would have know that it would have saved me all this effort trying to understand these pesky tides.  Other than that just wondering if we are going to see you boys down here in December.  If you get a date let me know so I can be sure to be around.  Good to hear you are upright and taking nourishment.  And having had the pleasure of eating your cooking I am sure the nourishment is delicious.

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And it was great to hear from one of my “oldest” readers. His comments probably more accurately reflect many of our real life experience with tide and weather.

Doug, after reading your dissertation on tides, I now will call  you” professor Salt”.

As usual, we all get answers from you on whatever the question is asked and this helps all, including novice and experienced anglers. You did some “homework” on Steve’s inquiry on tidal flows. All of this shows your love of fishing and sharing it with others.

Me, living in Bastrop, always hit the bays with a wing and a prayer. Many trips have been wind blown when the forecast was winds up to 10 mph. Other times tides forecast high ended up with me arriving up to a mud flat. Sometimes my return trip home is without fish, but like you fishing our coastal waters is a passion. Just getting out on a quiet pristine back bay makes life bearable. Fall fishing makes the hair on the back of my neck stand up when a pod of Reds crosses my path. The wind is calm and many are deer hunting. I wish deer season lasted all year long!!

As for tides. growing up in Port A, I hung around many guides and learned that 90% of the fish are in 10 % of the water . I learned that according to Totsy Belcher, who was a top guide there said” there will be Reds in most tidal flats with turtle grass bottoms when the tide was 1.5 ft or higher and if he tide was moving in or out, the fish would be moving about. It would be just locating them”. Many of these old guides have passed on and often there secrets went to the grave with them. “Betty of the jetty” in Port A. was a regular old crusty women who cursed all who fished near her. She always caught trout and Reds in any kind of weather. Her secret–she never fished with an artificial bait, but she told me –“Mac, you got to fish often and use bingo lures while you are young, because one day when you are old you will have to fish like me with nasty old shrimp. Well Betty “rest your soul” cause I am old and I can still toss a topwater.

We all meet special people, and Doug, even though most of your readers have never met you , we all are literally in the boat with you, when you fish. Do keep doing what you do. I used to look foreword to the daily newspaper but computers have replaced em’, but your late night or early morning tales take the paper’s place.

Thanks, Mac

PS- I, myself, never pay attention to tides-I thought Tide was a soap!!!!!!!!!!!

It is good to hear from you, when I have not heard from you for a while I notice.  So much to comment on.  First the loss of the “old ones.”  I can only imagine how the real old salts filed it all away in their mind without the use of a tide chart from years of experience.  Truly reading the water.  To bad so much knowledge has not been recorded for posterity.  We may have all the stuff but they were the real foundation of our sport, it really is a loss for all of us when their stories are lost.  And I am so with you on the deer hunting.  Now don’t get me wrong I love me some venison, but that opening week is my favorite to be on the water.

As far as answering questions I try to do it the best I can.  When you have a witness on the stand and are cross examining them you learn real quick about answering questions.  Making stuff up is as bad as lying, maybe worse as you look like an idiot.  So I try to answer the best I can with what little I know.  There are times I feel like I am on the “stand’ when I write something.  Not sure I like being on the other side of the equation. Last, you know me, fall and redfish go together like the 60’s and tube tops.  My favorite time of the year.  And your kind words humble me.  It keeps me writing when I really want to watch football and drink a cold one, though I have been know to do both on a Saturday or Sunday afternoon.  So here is to you tossing that topwater many more falls.  It keeps us alive.

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And Ed had a question related to the post.  Lets see if we can answer it.

That’s some interesting stuff. Makes sense to be where the water is moving.
I use the site called tides4fishing and use the high and lows as my point of reference.
I just never figured that the times were so spread out. I like to fish the areas of mule slough, boggy bayou , coast guard, bayocous and bar-room . So an example for myself is if low tide is at 10am (that’s for the jetties?) then I should be setup at coast guard by 6? Or 2pm. Did that make any sense?

Ed

Good question.  Lets think about it this way.  First remember that you can use the POC times, which is the little jetties, or the surfer site for Pass Cavallo, both which are relevant to where you fish.  I don’t think there is a time for the big jetties.  If you use the example from the 4th the high at Pass Cavallo was around 8:25, so if you think about it your are literally almost there when you set up on the old coast guard station!  So if the low is at 10:00 at the pass, you really should only have to look at a tide graph looking for the big change in water flow to be there at the right tide, depending on which tide you want to fish.  It is why when I looked at a map to get it in my head where the tide monitoring stations are related to the rest of the bay, did it finally start to make a little more sense.   So based on where you like to fish, looking at both the Pass Cavallo times and the POC times you should be able to figure it out close at most of the places you fish.  If you are like me it might take a while, but keeping track of what the water is doing where you are fishing,  related to the tide times, will really begin to sink it in.  Let’s hope!  Thanks.

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Trying to figure this all out is giving me a headache, but it is a good one.  There are so many factors concerning the tide that have to be taken into account any time you hit the bay.  To tell you how dense I can be we fished a day last fall with one big tide.  Our first stop was around Pringle and the tide was running out perfect, then it started to slack.  Our third stop was way down the island past the first chain.  We set up on a drain and the water was again running out just perfect.  In my ignorance I am thinking what is up with the second tide?  From what I now know it was one of 2 things.  First, the falling tide was that far behind POC and we made the perfect move taking advantage of the long run.  Or the other option, there were a couple of periods of good running water, and when it slacked at Pringle it was just a pause and had not gotten to low tide yet.  Both of these posssibilities would have been answered with just a review of tidal flow and times before we went that day.  The old saying is so applicable to the tides  –  “Poor planning equals poor performance.”  Or in my case every once in while you just get lucky.

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And further thinking about tides, it is no wonder I have always liked Big Bayou.  There is a 12 – 15″ deep hole that has been scoured out by water draining from the flats adjacent to Big Bayou.  Big Bayou should probably be called Big Bayou Pass.  It funnels water from the vast flats that surround it, and it has hollowed out one of the deeper channels in our local bays.  That deep water offers protection and comfort for the fish, plus the heavy flow that rings the dinner bell.   If you think about it, it empties directly into open water and out Pass Cavallo it goes.

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There is so much to digest and when readers participate we all benefit.  I will sit down and try to rewrite the original article using this information and comments.  And all of this really has me thinking about planning moves based on getting where I want, which in my case is falling tide.  Getting there a couple of times most days would be a thing of beauty. Be it flounder on a steep grassy shoreline, trout in the middle of a drain, or reds scouring the edges as water falls out of the grass, falling tides are my favorite.  I am going to try to pay a lot more attention to the tide and flow projections, and then do a little more planning on projected moves.  Who knows, it just might pay off.

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Hope you have all learned something with these to tide posts, I know I have.  If any of you have anything to add, either technical or your on the water experiences, please chime in.  We are far from done with this subject.  Tomorrow I will be on the water somewhere.  I am about to check the weather, tides, flows, Ouija board, and my granddaughter Baby Wren to decide where and how.  So keep stopping in and thanks for reading my stuff.

Good Luck and Tight Lines